david your missing my point about the 16inch wheels and tyres they were too big and im trying to drop the gearing slightly, just checked the rolling radious of the wheels and they are as near as damn it the same as 165-400, if you look at these 2 pics side by side one is with 400mm wheels and the other is with the 15's, like i said it will come down a load when there is weight in it, at the moment its a bare shell with 2 axles so suspension is on maximimum up at the moment , last photo shows on the rear inner arch where the origional tyres fitted rubbed the inner arches, there is conciderably more ofset on the alloy wheels to the outside so gives me more clearance,